Talk:Climate change policies in Helsinki

Memos of the meetings with Siemens / UEF / Helsinki Env. Centre

Memo of 15.4.2015

8.4.2015 at 14.30-15.30 EET / Trond, Petteri, Florian, Jouni, Sonja

We agreed that by Thursday 23.4. Jouni needs a list of building categories and contact persons for students to start the work.

Building categories will be the same as in Copenhagen:

• residential
• public & administration
• industrial
• other non-residential

Contact persons:

• Building registry (building stock) / Rakennuskantatiedot (Rakvv/Pirjo Pekkarinen)----#: . we try to get Jukka Puttonen from Env Centre to help as Pirjo said she can´t help right now --Signatiu (talk) 14:07, 23 April 2015 (UTC) (type: truth; paradigms: science: comment)
• Public & administrational buildings (building stock, energy consumption) / Julkiset palvelurakennukset rakennuskantatiedot ja energiatiedot (HKR/Katri Kuusinen)
• Energy production / Energiantuotantotiedot (Helen/Rauno -> Petteri will be the contact person.)
• Emission coefficients and calculation method / Päästökertoimet ja laskentamenetelmät (HSY/Johannes)
• Population data and climate targets / Väestö ja ilmastotavoitteet (YMK/Petteri, 30 % selvitys)
• Street lighting and lighting in general / Katuvalaistus ja muut valaistusasiat (HKR/Juhani Sandström)
• Electricity used in others than public & admin. buildings / Muiden kuin julkisten rakennusten sähkön jakauma (Helen/Rauno ja Motiva xx?)
• Heat losses and U values / Lämpöhävikit ja U-arvot (Rakvv Pirjo Pekkarinen) ----#: . we try to get Jukka Puttonen from Env Centre to help as Pirjo said she can´t help right now --Signatiu (talk) 14:07, 23 April 2015 (UTC) (type: truth; paradigms: science: comment)
• Cooling of buildings / Rakennusten jäähdytys (Helen/Rauno -> Petteri will be the contact person.)
• Transport data, modal split / Liikennetiedot ja kulkutavat (HSL Natalia Berezina, KSV Tuija Hellman, HSL Helena Suomela)

The data on buildings owned by City of Helsinki are likely to be more accurate than the ones from other sources.

Trond presented what the model needs for the transport section. The data must represent the transport within city borders. NB. aviation is not included. Accurate data on taxis can be difficult to get but it is not a big share of the cars in Helsinki. I will not go through different variables for transport but it would be good if Trond could sent the presentation or upload it here. The gathering of transport data will not be done by students but by Env. Centre.

The memos of the meetings will be gathered in this open Opasnet page as long as there is no confidential information. Anyone of us is free to fill in the text.

Next meeting on 24.4. at 13-14 EET We will discuss following points:

• follow-up of the work
• some contact persons didn´t agree on helping at this short notice -> how to deal with missing data
• what next.

--Signatiu (talk) 14:02, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

Memo of 8.4.2015

8.4.2015 at 12 EET / Markku, Trond, Petteri, Florian, Jouni, Sonja

Jouni presented a summary of data variables based on the excel sheet and Trond´s presentation. We discussed how to further proceed with data gathering and what are the relevant things we need to decide at this stage.

There are 10 categories of buildings presented in CyPT

• Three main categories for Helsinki: Residential, Government & public administration, Non-Residential
• Of the non-residential buildings the Env. Centre needs to specify what sub-categories should be taken into account.
• Petteri suggested two more separate categories: industrial buildings, shopping malls & stores
• The categories can be merged to larger ones afterwards but now we need to specify of which categories we need detailed data.
• In Copenhagen four or five categories were used.

Data of Copenhagen would be very useful for Helsinki for comparison, since the properties will be probably quite similar. Siemens will provide us with data of Copenhagen. The data of Helsinki will be free to use by anybody.

Floor areas and energy consumption (also per use type, at least roughly) will be available but there is likely to be problems with finding data of the oh-so-horrifying lamp types (but luckily it is only priority 3).

Jouni´s students will only concentrate on the building data. Energy data and transport data are supposed to be easier to find. People at Env. Centre need to decide who will collect this data. N.B. transport data should only include transportation inside the city borders -> this we need to ask HSL authorities about.

Good documentation is crucial especially now that there are many different people gathering the data. This has to be planned well in advance to have clear principles for everyone. Who has found the data, who was contacted and description of the parameter.

To be discussed in next meeting:

• impressions of the students & how they found the task
• how to gather the transport and energy data
• can the excel and power point Trond sent us be published in Opasnet + how much of the model can be explained to the students and made public
• documentation

Next meeting on 15.4.2015 at 14.30 (EET). --Signatiu (talk) 14:09, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

Discussions about climate change policies in Helsinki

Possible topics:

• City level climate change mitigation is useless because success depends on international treaties.⇤--#: . I think Europe union's decisions has pretty affect on the city and mamber states dicision making, but that does not mean that the city level climate changes are useless. --Mohammad Shahidehnia (talk) 10:29, 29 April 2015 (UTC) (type: truth; paradigms: science: attack)
• Climate change policies should consider health impacts and other collateral impacts as they may be significant.
• Climate change adaptation is more important than mitigation on city level.
• Citizens have a key role in implementing city climate policies.
• Food issues are underrepresented in climate discussions although food is a major emission source.
• District heating by nuclear energy should be considered in Helsinki.
• The CO₂ emission factors of biofuels should be reconsidered: the assumption of zero emissions is not true.

How to read discussions

Fact discussion: .
Opening statement: Citizens have a key role in implementing city climate policies. Closing statement: Resolution not yet found. (Resolved, i.e., a closing statement has been found and updated to the main page.)
Argumentation: ←--#: . I think citizens do play an important part in city climate policies for example in Accra, Ghana many of the residents refused to change their old refrigerators concerning the emission of CFCs and thus the policy by the authorities of using new refrigerators to help reduce CFCs was not beneficial --Michael Osei Assibey (talk) 13:09, 5 May 2015 (UTC) (type: truth; paradigms: science: defence)

How to read discussions

Fact discussion: .
Opening statement: The CO2 emission factors of biofuels should be reconsidered: the assumption of zero emissions is not true. Closing statement: Resolution not yet found. (Resolved, i.e., a closing statement has been found and updated to the main page.)
Argumentation: ←--#: . Biomass combustion can release more GHGs per produced energy unit than is released fossil fuels. It can take decades for growing biomass to capture the same amount of CO2 that is released when utilizing biofuel [1] --Anni Hartikainen (talk) 22:54, 6 May 2015 (UTC) (type: truth; paradigms: science: defence) ⇤--#: . If forest management is done correctly, regrowing forests can in the end act as carbon sinks. [2] --Anni Hartikainen (talk) 22:54, 6 May 2015 (UTC) (type: truth; paradigms: science: attack)